Supporting Students with Disabilities

Transcript

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Katie: I've started to notice that when you correct students and correct especially their negative self-talk, they can be really strong advocates for themselves.

Natieka: Hello and welcome to School Me, the National Education Association's podcast dedicated to helping educators thrive at every stage of their careers. I'm your host, Natieka Samuels. In this episode, we're discussing how educators can support students with disabilities in schools and sharing tactics and practices educators can implement to foster [00:00:30] inclusivity and combat ableism. Our guest today is Katie Punsly, a creative writing teacher in Louisville, Kentucky with years of experience as an instructional technology coach, working with English language learners and serving the needs of students with disabilities. Welcome, Katie. Can you tell us a little bit about yourself, where you're currently working and what you teach?

Katie: I'm here in Kentucky. I teach creative writing at W.E.B. DuBois Academy, which is an academy of excellence for young men of color.

Natieka: Why did you decide [00:01:00] that you wanted to become an educator?

Katie: I was a literature and philosophy major in college. I decided, of all things, to go to graduate school in philosophy at Georgia State University in Atlanta. And at the time, I really thought I wanted to be an academic, but the thing I turned out to be way better at was teaching college freshmen. I was teaching a section of 1010 Critical Thinking and I noticed a pattern that a lot of [00:01:30] these college freshmen were released struggling with reading and writing. And after the final in my course, a couple of those students turned to each other and recognized they had gone to the same high school and I realized they were products of the same school system in Atlanta. And I figured out that the sort of pivotal points for developing reading and writing were fourth grade and eighth grade, and that drew me into the middle school world and that's where I've sort of spent my career.

Natieka: You were an instructional [00:02:00] technology coach and now you teach creative writing. So can you talk a little bit about that journey?

Katie: I love technology. After a number of years teaching, I had the opportunity to become an instructional technology coach, and I think both types of work are so crucial. To me, coaching is important because it feels like you're really getting to impact those larger systems at once. That's a little bit harder because you're removed from that direct impact, but everything, it's about timing. So [00:02:30] I first got hired as an instructional technology coach right during the pandemic, during NTI, during lockdown when everything was virtual. I really thrived during that environment as someone who loves technology, but it meant that my job was supporting all the people who really struggled with that stuff.

So then we got back in the buildings. The teacher shortage was impacting everything in such a huge way and there wasn't really a time where I wasn't covering for some position or vacancy. And so I [00:03:00] think there was a semester where I was covering a class almost the entire time for a colleague who was sick. So I really loved my work, but I think my area of certification is just too valuable because English is a tested subject and all, but I'm really glad to be in creative writing, which is just kind of a fun spin on this curriculum. And I've always been passionate about English as an English major, but I try to bring that kind of big systems thinking to my class [00:03:30] and we're always trying to do cool stuff at the school level where we can.

Natieka: You briefly mentioned that the vision for the school that you currently work at was to intentionally set up a school for students of color that has a focus on excellence. So how do you define excellence in the context of your school's vision?

Katie: The mission for DuBois is to empower young men to achieve excellence, and we do this specifically through an Afrocentric lens because [00:04:00] we really believe that our Black and brown students miss out so much in terms of positive representation. So for example, for most of our students, they learn about slavery because it's in the standards, but they always grown because especially our kids coming from other schools coming up as sixth graders, that's all they hear in terms of Black history and they hear over and over and we know that's problematic because that's just not all there is. We know that for African [00:04:30] history that there's a powerful legacy of kings and queens. We know that in African American history, there are so many important civil rights heroes and we just don't talk enough about it. We don't use them as models of inspiration for our students. So at our school, we don't say the Pledge of Allegiance, we say our own Brotherhood Creed, and the last line of the Brotherhood Creed is, "I was born to achieve greatness, and I will determine the king I become."

Natieka: So even though you don't teach special education classes [00:05:00] in particular, you do have a collection of students that might have different needs and abilities. Correct?

Katie: Yeah. So every year in public education, students are like a box of chocolates. You never know what you're going to get. And so I've taught on all kinds of teams. You never know if you're going to be on the AP team. We used to call it the ESL team, now we're the multilingual learner team. And this year in our seventh grade, we do have a number of special education students along with gifted and talented [00:05:30] students and all kinds of other students that we serve.

Natieka: What are some examples of the ways that you handle those students who might need adjustments or customizations to the way that you run your classroom?

Katie: We're always trying to think about specific things that they need, especially once they hit that middle school age, they're getting pretty good at being able to vocalize what it is. And as you get to know them, you kind of start to see when they need to take a break, [00:06:00] when they need a fidget, when they just need some space to stand up, take a walk around the back of the class where it's not going to bother anyone. So just making sure that they're getting a little bit of that sort of room and space to get their needs met because otherwise it's going to come out in their behavior and all that behavior is a way for them to communicate their needs when they can't verbalize what it is that they need.

Natieka: In your opinion, what are some common misconceptions [00:06:30] or stereotypes that people have about supporting students with disabilities, who are neurodivergent or have other special needs in schools?

Katie: So I mentioned we work on different teams, and I think sometimes teachers have different attitudes and stereotypes about working on these different teams. Sometimes teachers love to work on AP or gifted talented teams, and these teams will be mixed with different students. Sometimes they think that multilingual learner teams have [00:07:00] the quiet kids. Having worked on those teams, once you get to know those kids, they can be just as raucous and excited, especially if you speak their language. And I think that special education teams get kind of a bad rap. I love all of my kiddos. They are so much fun to work with. I think that any team has its challenges. Everyone always wants to say, "Oh, I want to work with AP and gifted and talented." But they have their challenges too. So I [00:07:30] definitely think that there's no perfect team, there's no best team, and most of the time in public schools you get all kinds anyway.

Natieka: Could you discuss practical strategies or accommodations that educators could make that would support neurodivergent students, for example, in the classroom?

Katie: I think that one of the most important things about working with our neurodivergent students is to collaborate with them and ask them what is best for their learning [00:08:00] environment. I think a thing to think about is that a classroom is kind of like a difficult public space where we have to sort of coexist. If you are neurodivergent and you want a quiet space, that can be hard to find for yourself. So maybe someone wants headphones or earplugs. On the other hand, if you want to sing to yourself, do you have that space? And we've had conversations in the classroom like that, this kid wants to be able to sing or rap [00:08:30] or whatever it is they want to do, and this other kid wants quiet. Well, how do we make it so that this space is comfortable for both of us? And so you have to acknowledge that coexisting and sharing space is hard and have that conversation.

I think that sometimes adults want to write it off or sweep those issues under the rug and go for whatever the overall group wants, but that doesn't acknowledge everything that makes life best for our neurodivergent students. I think also sometimes people will write off those kids as [00:09:00] weird, and that really doesn't work because it can contribute to a culture of bullying. We really have to talk about bullying, we have to talk about bullying honestly, because if we were to talk about our culture in school a decade, two decades ago, when we talk about who gets bullied, even now, a lot of the time it is those neurodivergent kids. And I think we really don't recognize how often those differences are policed even by adults [00:09:30] and students will imitate that. So we need to be really conscious of how we are as role models and make sure that we are the first people to celebrate and welcome those differences among our neurodivergent students.

Natieka: How do you advise that educators approach bullying when they see bullying happening, particularly if it's because of the student's disability in the school? Are there some tactics that you [00:10:00] like to use that you could pass on?

Katie: I think the first thing we have to acknowledge is that bullying most often happens because of difference, right? Bullying happens because of ableism. Bullying happens because of racism. Bullying happens because of sexism, homophobia. Those are the most frequent causes of bullying. And so when we teach about diversity, when we teach about inclusion, those are the biggest ways in which we combat bullying. [00:10:30] And so I really appreciate all the work that NEA has done, all the resources that they have, that those things aren't ancillary. Those are kind of important preventative tools. When you start to think about those things and internalize those things, it'll help as we do implicit bias awareness, all of that is going to kind of help train you to recognize microaggressions and the kind of language that you would use to combat bullying because they're all kind of on a spectrum. Those things don't happen [00:11:00] in a vacuum. They're about different and intolerance of difference.

Most of the student weirdness, again, I think comes down to that, why is it that behavior bothers you? And a lot of the time we have to talk about what is the purpose of that behavior, and sometimes it is related to some kind of neurodivergence. Other times when we talk about attention seeking and connection seeking behavior, we need to be thinking about what's the unmet need. And in [00:11:30] those cases, we're talking about some kind of social emotional learning that needs to happen. So there's a lot of opportunities when it comes to bullying, but it can be really difficult to take care of in a short class span.

Natieka: So how do you approach the issue of ableism in classroom rules or practices, and what are some examples of ableist practices that educators should stay mindful of?

Katie: I think that as we move to new forms of [00:12:00] learning and deeper learning, a lot of common ableist practices sort of naturally go by the wayside. So students needing to be seated at all times is sort of an older mode, but that can be really difficult for students who have chronic pain, who have ADHD. But having more flexible seating or places in the room where students can stand can be really helpful. I know that there are still places where the expectation is that [00:12:30] instructions are only given once and they're given orally. That can be really hard for our students who are hard of hearing or have auditory processing issues or again, our students with ADHD. And so it can be helpful for instructions to be given multiple times in multiple ways, individuals and with mnemonics. And that can also be helpful for our multilingual learners.

And I think that sometimes we have this old-fashioned idea that paying attention always means sitting still [00:13:00] with eye contact. I know that can be hard for our autistic students and our poor ADHD students. So those fidget toys allowing doodling while focusing. So again, that flexible seating. Some people purchase bouncy vans that you can have under seats. So those things are becoming more in vogue and giving students choice for their seating I think is also becoming a more common practice.

Natieka: Thanks for listening to School Me and a quick thank you to all of the NEA [00:13:30] members listening. If you're not an NEA member yet, visit nea.org/whyjoin to learn more about member benefits.

And how did you learn so much about how to support your students with disabilities? Did you take any trainings or is it something that you learned as you went or other schooling?

Katie: I am part of the NEA Disability Resource Cadre, and I've learned so much from my students, from disability advocates. [00:14:00] They will tell you, I think that's just one of the biggest things is being open-minded and really hearing people. I think it's really easy to sometimes assume that students are trying to get a little extra or trying to fidget with something because they want to play with a toy, but it can really be helpful and make a huge difference. And if you aren't comfortable with the fidget that they bring, I'll have a class set or a half class set, and you know they're [00:14:30] not especially fun. They're really just there for fidgeting. And so I think that takes out some of the extra incentive. It's just there to help them focus.

Natieka: Can you share any personal experiences or anecdotes where addressing ableism directly actually positively impacted the learning experience of a student or many students with disabilities in your school?

Katie: I've really appreciated as students sort of gain awareness [00:15:00] of their own disabilities, how they've been able to become kind of advocates for themselves and been able to talk about their neurodivergence in a positive way. So I think it's difficult in middle schools because there are so much criticism and pejorative language at that age and put downs and things like that. But I've started to notice that when you correct students and correct, especially [00:15:30] their negative self-talk, they can be really strong advocates for themselves. So you often hear kids call each other like, slow, or the one I hate the most is SPED as a pejorative for special education, just awful. And as you start to correct some of that ableist language, you kind of hear the shift in their thinking. And especially for some of our ADHD students, you can hear them start to self-advocate more like, "I'm ADHD [00:16:00] and I know that I need more time and I know that I need this to focus and I know that I need headphones and I need this space."

I think that's so awesome that they are 12 years old and they can advocate for themselves with an adult That is so powerful. There are these awesome posters that you can get about all the positive qualities of various types of neurodivergence. Like they'll [00:16:30] say like, "ADHD makes me adventurous or humorous or creative, or whatever it is." And I think that kind of helps shape the narrative away from the sort of pejoratives that they're kind of used to, and it helps them kind of understand like, "Oh, I'm really artistic." And you can kind of start to see that language shift too.

Natieka: That seems really important because even adults in working environments don't always have the courage to ask for what they need or the knowledge to ask for what [00:17:00] they need in order to do their best work. So hopefully that keeps growing among the children and maybe a whole change in work culture too. How about disability representation in classrooms and curriculum? How have you handled that in your work and how do you think that schools could be more inclusive, not just in the classroom practices, but overall in how they teach and how they function?

Katie: Yeah, I've been thinking a lot about how right [00:17:30] now it's Black History Month and we think a lot about how to make sure that our students in our Afrocentric curriculum get to see themselves represented, but also who are our great ADHD thinkers, who are our great autistic thinkers, and to make sure that those folks are also in our curriculum so that they also get to see like, "Oh, there are people like me who went on to be inventors scientists and do all kinds of cool [00:18:00] things." And so I think that's a really important intentional piece in our curriculum, and those make for great posters as well. So to be incorporating some more of that disability representation, I think also is helpful outside of not just Disability Awareness Month, but also all year round.

Natieka: What role do you think that empathy and understanding play in creating a more inclusive [00:18:30] environment for all students, but particularly those with disabilities?

Katie: I think the most important thing is curiosity. So why do students do what they do and what do the behaviors mean when students are acting the way they act? What is it that indicates and what are their needs? And trying to help them better communicate with those behaviors. It can be difficult [00:19:00] when you're neurodivergent, when you have a physical disability or a not apparent disability to always communicate. And that's a skill that you definitely develop as you get older. So just to have that kind of curiosity to try to understand and help students become those self advocates.

I know that there is kind of a growing trend for students to sit in on their IEP meetings, their Individualized Education Plan [00:19:30] meetings so that they can be part of their goal setting process, but to sort of build those scaffolds for them to sort of start to reflect on the bigger picture for them. So I think that as we are building these learning environments to really be conscious of why it is they do what they do, how it is they operate, and to have those conversations with them and help them self-reflect and help them kind come to that understanding.

Natieka: [00:20:00] How has your union and your involvement with your union helped you learn more about how you can support your students, particularly those with disabilities better throughout your time teaching?

Katie: I think I mentioned earlier that the NEA Disability Resource Cadre is where I've done a lot of this work. They've been absolutely phenomenal. My K president who selected me to be part of the cadre, and so gotten to do a lot of work [00:20:30] through the cadre. Right now, we're working on a learning management system where participants are going to be able to learn all kinds of different things about disability and ableism. The section I'm working on specifically is on disability and representation. That's going to be really fun, interactive, blended learning experience. And so through that work, we've gotten a chance to publish a bunch of articles through NEA today, and there's been a book study [00:21:00] that's been going on. The next one might be The Pretty One by Keah Brown. But yeah, it's been just phenomenal to have so much support by a lot of really fantastic people.

Natieka: For those who might not be familiar, can you briefly describe the cadre and the goals of the cadre?

Katie: It's a national cadre of NEA members, and it has both current practitioners in the classroom of general [00:21:30] educators, special educators, counselors, and retired educators. And they're all folks who are very familiar with everything from the IDEA, so Individuals with Disabilities Education Act to IEPs, to anything related to special education. And so we have folks who work with a lot with autism, specifically me who's more [00:22:00] interested in ableism, people with all kinds of different specialties. And we take care of any sort of new business item that the NEA Representative Assembly has around disability rights and inclusion. And then anything that the NEA does around disability rights and inclusion work, that's pretty much one of our charges. Now, we work really closely with the Ford Foundation. They've been funding a lot of our work, and [00:22:30] so we put some learning courses out through our learning management system, publish a number of articles through NEA Today, and then also do some work in partnership with other organizations as well.

Natieka: So I will include a link to NEA's Supporting Individuals with Disabilities page for you to review if you are interested in learning more about what kind of resources we have and see some of the work of the cadre in action.

Looking ahead, what do you envision [00:23:00] as some key steps or initiatives for schools to further enhance the support that they already provide for students with disabilities and also just promoting overall more true diversity and inclusivity in education?

Katie: Well, I think that disability representation is going to be that next important piece. Really thinking about deep intersectional representation is going to be incredibly important. I think for a long time [00:23:30] it's felt like it was enough to have one student with a wheelchair on a poster, but what we really need to be thinking about is how is the Black autistic experience different from the white male autistic experience. So we need to be really thinking about how things are different for our students of color who are neurodivergent, and how we can kind of make sure that all of our students at the intersection [00:24:00] of disability, race, gender, sexual orientation are seen in our schools, are welcome in our schools. I think that's kind of our next step as we ensure inclusivity.

And we're still in many ways behind in our curricular representation, and we're still fighting battles that we shouldn't be, just trying to get very basic levels of representation in some state, but we [00:24:30] need to be, I think very loud and very clear about how important this to our students, many of whom have never ever seen themselves, who have never been able to believe in themselves or believe they're capable of anything because they've never heard stories where they were ever the heroes. And so I think it's really time to change that and make it possible for them in our classrooms today.

Natieka: Thank you so much for joining us today, Katie.

Katie: Have a great day. [00:25:00] Thank you so much.

Natieka: Thanks for listening. Make sure you subscribe so you don't miss a single episode of School Me and take a minute to rate the show and leave a review. It really helps us out and it makes it easier for more educators to find us. For more tips to help you bring the best to your students, text POD to 48744.